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Marushin "Tomenosuke PRO" Blaster Japan
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hirohawa
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why is it there an assumption that a firing blaster could not be made from the Tomenosuke Marushin Pro?

The "pro" seems like a good candidate with it's aluminum castings.
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racprops
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it can.

And your right, if they are alummium, the side covers could be better.

I have said I was willing to do one.

There are a few parts that may need be replace with mine like the trigger guard..due to how they put theirs together.

Rich
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Vader
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Running the risk of taking his joke much too seriously, I feel I must contest Doc's sentiment for a bit: Sure, we can't make a functional Star Trek phaser, but we can make a functional BR blaster, just like we could make a functional Pulse Rifle, or a functional SW Stormtrooper blaster, or a Smartgun, or any other kind of movie weapon based on a real firearm. This much is granted.

But would that make it really functional? To my mind, the answer must be a resounding no.
It seems to me that the implication in Bladerunner is that the weapon "actually" fires something else than ordinary .44cal bullets I mean, if the weapon was in fact supposed to just do what a standard .44 revolver does, why does it look like something completely different? In fact, why have the prop makers gone out of their way to hide even every suggestion of the fact that at the heart of the gun, there lurks a revolver?

It's the same with e.g. the Pulse Rifle: building it on a real, firing Thompson doesn't make it fire 10mm AP Caseless, or the magazine hold 95 rounds. Nor does building the Stormtrooper blaster out of a real, firing Sterling make it fire blaster bolts.
These things are still just props, and building them over real weapons was nothing more than a convenient short cut for the filmmakers to create a credible firing effect during filming.

In that sense, in comparison to the Star Trek phaser, prop gun replicas built out of real, functioning firearms are still just as much overpriced toys as a phaser replica that shoots light beams from an LED or, for that matter, completely inert replica firearms with, of course, the difference that these toys shoot.
But, it's still impossible to make a weapon that fires whatever it's supposed to fire in the film's reality, just as much as with the phaser!

Now, for my own part, I certainly wouldn't say no to a blaster built out of a real Bulldog, using real Steyr parts, and the whole nine yards. But not because it shoots, but because it's the way the original prop was built.
To me, a shooting replica is in no way better, or more intrinsically valuable, or more "real", because it shoots. But it may be all of that because it is more screen accurate!

Hence, I will not hesitate ... very long, at least ... to pay for accurate inert replicas, like a Coyle or a Tome, and the fact that they do not shoot is not and can not in itself be a factor in my consideration. Apart from the fact that if they did shoot, they would be seriously illegal under the laws of the country I live in...
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doc3d
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll believe a Tomenosuke PRO can be made into an operational firearm when I see one being fired on youtube.

The issue of firearm bans in various countries is sticky. One of these BR toys isn't worth going to jail for.

Nothing, absolutely nothing, in the world is perfect. Firearms have evolved and changed, even within the same basic models. For example the number of screws on Smith and Wesson revolvers, etc. So why should we assume the Blaster is a fixed design? I remember the endless squabbling over whether or not a Weaver screw was used. Who cares?!!!

Sorry if someone lives in a country where a handgun isn't allowed. Guess you don't get to play. However, be assured your gangsters will certainly have handguns, and all they want.

A little info and bio: My BR gun is completely legal. It's just a Charter Arms Bulldog with some added junk attached. It is not a newly manufactured weapon. It has Charter Arms serial numbers on the frame. I even have a lawfully issued permit to carry it concealed, should I want to walk around permanently listing to one side. For the record, and within the terms of my concealed carry license, I'm *always* armed, except in places like airports, schools, courthouses, etc. which are proscribed. I carry a reworked Kel-Tec P3AT in .380 caliber equipped with an Armalaser sight, loaded with Glaser rounds. I'm not paranoid, but I do choose not to be a victim. I've done my time in the military, and I practice with the Kel-Tec regularly to maintain my skills. I also hunt with a rebuilt 1903A3 Springfield 30-06.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/85452191@N00/3007491526/in/photostream

I'm aware that the weapon of choice for most people is the automobile... a ton or so of metal and plastic that can turn an entire family of humans into meatpaste in an instant.

I don't regard my BR gun as a weapon, despite being a functional firearm, and one that *does* perform exactly as seen in the movie (though admittedly not looking *precisely* like the gat in the flick.) As I've already said, it's just a toy, albeit a dangerous toy.

I can't get my head around rabid rigid adherence to some unattainable level of perfection for a toy. Life's too short.

Doc
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doc3d
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok. No more posts on shooter conversion. I promise on a stack of thick multiethnic multidenominational theological documents.

All I'll do in my final appearance on this thread is to state that the best blaster out there, with the most attention to detail involving literally years of research and study, isn't the Tomenosuke. It's the one made here in the good old USA by Richard Coyle. The Japanese may make better cars (I drive a Yaris) but an American makes the best blaster.

I'll be appearing elsewhere with pics of my Gaff hat (modified with LED arrays and EL wire for night visibility at Burning Man).

Doc

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"Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one."

--A. J. Liebling
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Hasenbrau
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Haha - who said the Japanese make better cars? Hey I like Japanese cars plenty, but my 39 year old Nissan is way harder to keep running than my 46 year old ford. And my $500, 200K mile crown vic has passed plenty of broken down hondas and toyotas during my 90 mile commute. Razz

I know, completely off topic, but I just hate that assumption. Very Happy

Okay what were we talking about? Oh Yeah; Blaster's, right.
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Vader
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah. Pity us. We don't get to play. Boo-hoo. Rolling Eyes

A number of posts later, and I'm sort of none the wiser ... somebody who speaks Doc, could you please explain the joke here:

First,
doc3d wrote:
I remember the endless squabbling over whether or not a Weaver screw was used. Who cares?!!!
...
I can't get my head around rabid rigid adherence to some unattainable level of perfection for a toy.

And then,
doc3d wrote:
...to state that the best blaster out there, with the most attention to detail involving literally years of research and study, isn't the Tomenosuke. It's the one made here in the good old USA by Richard Coyle. The Japanese may make better cars (I drive a Yaris) but an American makes the best blaster.

So which one is it? Does the detail and the perfection matter lending perhaps some relevance to the question of which country makes the best blaster replica or does it not? Should we care about it one way or the other, or should we not?


I do find myself rather amazed by the philosophy, though. If we go back to the first principles of the prop replica hobby, I would have assumed that everybody took the quest for perfection, within some reasonable limits, for granted.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I've understood the whole point of the entire "Blade Runner Blaster Information and Discussion" category to be to share information about and discuss Deckard's blaster. Deckard's blaster. Not some totally fictitious, and hence utterly pointless, evolved version of it that never existed in the production, but a limited number of most specific movie props the hero and the stunts that each looked one way, and one way only.

Building and collecting prop replicas is a hobby. In this hobby, it is my experience that value and success are deemed in terms of screen accuracy, not on whether or not you can use the finished replica to kill somebody the same way you could with the original.
The question comes down to what the primary function of the prop is: to shoot bullets or to look a specific way and many of us in this hobby find the delving into the endlessly minute details of that look, attainable or not, fun.
But then again, as with all other hobbies, this one isn't for everybody.

The question if the screen accuracy can be brought up to the point of the replica actually saying "bang" is, as we've noted, not seldom a question of local legislation and about 6.6 billion of us on this planet do not obey under American gun laws.
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doc3d
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:45 pm    Post subject: A bit off topic... however Reply with quote

hopefully, the siteguru will let me get away with this brief excursion...

Vader, did you notice the 1 moa red dot 2x scope on my Springfield? (see earlier post.) Wanna guess where it was made? Sweden!

I also was more or less made in Sweden (my last name is Swanson)... my grandparents were immigrants... Wink

BTW, I also love Crown Vics... America made the best *muscle* cars ever built. But being poor, I need the 50 mpg (at 55mph on the flat) my Yaris gets, or I'd have to resort to the indignity of riding a bicycle, having foolishly sold my Norton motorcycle... Wink

We could discuss why you pass so many dead Japanese cars on the highway, but we'd quickly be into statistics; or what Mark Twain referred to as the progression of truth (Lies, Damned Lies, and Statistics.) Wink

Doc
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Vader
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Aimponit? Yeah. Nice piece of kit, that. They make some of the best scopes out there ... so you might say Sweden makes almost as good sighting devices as Japan makes cars. Almost.

Myself, I was made in Finland. Sweden is just where I happen to live.

End of excursion.
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Hasenbrau
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:25 pm    Post subject: Re: A bit off topic... however Reply with quote

doc3d wrote:


BTW, I also love Crown Vics... America made the best *muscle* cars ever built. But being poor, I need the 50 mpg (at 55mph on the flat) my Yaris gets, or I'd have to resort to the indignity of riding a bicycle, having foolishly sold my Norton motorcycle... Wink

We could discuss why you pass so many dead Japanese cars on the highway, but we'd quickly be into statistics; or what Mark Twain referred to as the progression of truth (Lies, Damned Lies, and Statistics.) Wink

Doc


Fair enough doc, there certainly are way more civics on the road these days than '90s crown vics. Of course none of them have 8-way power adjusting bench seats! I was really just teasing. I love cars period. doesn't really matter where they come from, and there's no arguing with 50mpg!

As far as the whole precision accuracy vs a working replica or one that is exactly screen accurate sans the working part; I personally find precision accuracy cool, and I respect the guys who put the effort in to achieve it. I enjoy admiring their craftsmanship and I love the detail discovery discussions that come up from time to time concerning the actual movie prop.

For me however, I prefer a "replica" that's been improved. Most props are made to look good on screen not in the hand. I'd rather my toys be as real as possible, which isn't generally the case for an actual movie prop. So I guess my ideal Blaster is one made out of real gun parts, with all the little skewed angels corrected and any safety concerns addressed if the thing's going to be made to fire. At the same time I love my Hartford and when I show my pals or neighbors they just say something along the lines of "Oh cool, is that the gun from Blade Runner?" And I get a kick out of that.

Would I turn down the perfect replica? Of course not, but I personally don't place a whole lot of hobby value on pursuing the perfect Blaster, though again I'm glad there are people who do and I respect that.

I think a good example is something like the Black Dodge charger from the next fast and the furious movie. I saw a video on some of the cars used in the filming. The "Hero" car Vin Diesel drives is a total hunk of junk. A slapped together 68 charger with some under powered chevy motor and a fake super charger bolted over the carburator. The guy in the video said something along the lines of "This car wasn't really built to be driven, it was built to look good for a few minutes at a time on camera." I bet that most folks who decide to go out and build a replica of that movie car are going to make significant improvements over the actual prop.
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CessnaDriver
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no right answer, it is different for each collector what they wish to collect and why.

I think the common thread is love of the film and it's meaning to each of us that makes us want to own a small piece of that world. Thousands of films many of us have seen, but a few really connect.

I am just happy the film has gotten it's respected due and places like this exist for fans and collectors to enjoy it years and years later.

So if it's a weaver knob or a functional or non functional prop, the clothes, the incredible aesthetic and pure art of it all.

Who cares, it's all BLADE RUNNER!

One of the greatest films ever made.
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SKIN JOB 66
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CessnaDriver wrote:
There is no right answer, it is different for each collector what they wish to collect and why.

I think the common thread is love of the film and it's meaning to each of us that makes us want to own a small piece of that world. Thousands of films many of us have seen, but a few really connect.

I am just happy the film has gotten it's respected due and places like this exist for fans and collectors to enjoy it years and years later.

So if it's a weaver knob or a functional or non functional prop, the clothes, the incredible aesthetic and pure art of it all.

Who cares, it's all BLADE RUNNER!

One of the greatest films ever made.


+1


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Vader
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 5:39 am    Post subject: Re: A bit off topic... however Reply with quote

Hasenbrau wrote:
I'd rather my toys be as real as possible, which isn't generally the case for an actual movie prop. So I guess my ideal Blaster is one made out of real gun parts, with all the little skewed angels corrected ...

... but I personally don't place a whole lot of hobby value on pursuing the perfect Blaster, though again I'm glad there are people who do and I respect that.


I'd say this is my philosophy as well. I prefer idealised prop replicas to absolutely accurate copies I suppose one might say I prefer "screen accurate" to "set accurate", in that what I am interested in is a meticulously accurate replica of what I see looking all good and shiny on-screen, rather than a copy of what I would have seen had I visited the set.
While at the same time, I myself don't have the time or the focus to do all that the fastidious research to find out exactly which binding post it was that went into the prop.

But and this is the big one there is simply no way I can even begin to express the sheer enormity of my appreciation for the fact that there actually are people out there who do this work and openly share their findings with the community!

It's all thanks to you guys that when I do get my idealised, real looking prop replica, I can revel in the satisfaction of knowing that it is indeed accurate in every last detail (as far as legislation allows), down to the correct screw heads, binding posts and serial numbers.
If not for your efforts and generosity, this hobby wouldn't even exist. For that, you have my respect, and my gratitude (...and not seldom, a fair chunk of my hard earned dosh)!
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joberg
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 6:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome back Doc (loved your vids on YouTube), nice to see that that ol' sense of humour has matured with age, like a good wine (pun intended Wink ) As a recycler (model/prop making) I'm in awe when I see guys on the RPF reproducing models using the same greeblies used by the modelmakers in ILM in the '70s Shocked Talk about research and money Exclamation . Same about any type of hobby. We should never forget that, at the end of the day, it's your happiness that matter. , screen accurate or not, real life or not..."whatever gets you through the night" as John Lennon said.
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Vader
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

joberg wrote:
We should never forget that, at the end of the day, it's your happiness that matter. , screen accurate or not, real life or not..."whatever gets you through the night" as John Lennon said.

Word!

It is after all this diversity of interests and motivations that builds the community that is the hobby. So, we can probably afford the respect and courtesy to accept that others in the hobby have other priorities, and choose to fork up the big dosh for other things, than we do ourselves. Even if I do not agree, I do not need to rub the offenders' noses in my disagreement my opinion, however well considered, can't be so all-important that I do not need to care about other people's sensibilities.
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andy
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PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2011 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Black grips?...

http://tenshu53.exblog.jp/12513317/

Andy
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Noeland
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PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2011 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Patrol/uniformed officer version?
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joberg
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PostPosted: Wed May 04, 2011 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blimey Shocked ...another hole in our wallet?
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DaveG
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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 9:46 pm    Post subject: Got my Tomensuke Pro today! Reply with quote

I had thought the Tomensuke Pro was sold out, as that's what their website says, but I figured it couldn't hurt to check. So I had a Japanese friend of mine living here in the States contact them to find out. Turned out all I had to do was Paypal the money and they'd ship me a blaster! Four days later I have the blaster in hand!

I'd say the pictures don't do it justice, but they really do. What pictures don't convey is what it feels like to hold. Like a real firearm. They did an great job creating this replica. I know some of the details may not be 100 percent screen accurate but the fit and finish are exceptional. It would be nice if the frame, cylinder and barrel were metal, but I understand the legal restrictions and even made of plastic, they look really good.

I did ask about the black grips and was told they are prototypes for an upcoming blaster.
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joberg
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good score Dave, it's a great replica to add to your collection of BR related stuff...now, as you know there's a few guys here that could supply with real steel replacement pieces for your gun, if needs be Wink
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